#define: a game of fake definitions (Friends)
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
1hr 44min Sep 29, 2023
Jerod gathers a group of friends for our first game show experiment here on Changelog & Friends! This is a game of obscure jargon, fake definitions & expert tomfoolery. Our contestants checked their imposter syndrome at the door, because they either know what these words mean or they fake it ’til they make their peers think they do.
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Featuring:
- Amal Hussein – GitHub, X
- Taylor Troesh – Website, GitHub, LinkedIn
- Lars Wikman – Website, GitHub, X
- Jerod Santo – Website, GitHub, LinkedIn, Mastodon, X
- Adam Stacoviak – Website, GitHub, LinkedIn, Mastodon, X
Show Notes:
Something missing or broken? PRs welcome!
Jerod Santo
Welcome to \#define, our very first game show experiment here on Changelog & Friends. This is a game of obscure jargon, fake definitions, and expert tomfoolery. Our contestants checked their impostor syndrome at the door, because they either know what these words mean, or they're going to fake it till they make their peers think that they do. Let's introduce our players in the order they will be playing. First up, our very own Amal Hussein from JS Party. Welcome, Amal.
Amal Hussein
This is not the way I should be finding out that I'm going first, I'm just putting it out there... \[laughter\] But okay.
Jerod Santo
I should have prepped you on that? Is that what you're saying?
Amal Hussein
Yeah. That's okay. I really -- I want to go last. We're gonna reverse this link list, okay?
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh... It's like classic Amal. She's always got a problem with something you're doing. She's like against Jerod, every time.
Jerod Santo
I know. We've played game shows with you before. We know that the rules will be changing.
Amal Hussein
Hello, everyone. Meet the person who will be going last, which is me... \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Playing second, we have Taylor Troesh from taylor.town. Welcome back, Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
Howdy. Very nice to see you guys.
Jerod Santo
Nice to see you as well. After reading your blog and your satire, I figured "This guy has a way with words." And so I think you're well-positioned to do well in this particular game. What do you think?
Taylor Troesh
I like words. I feel like they often are against me... \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Okay. You couldn't think of the word there, I could tell. Up next - who's that? It's our old friend, Lars Wikman. Welcome to the show, Lars.
Lars Wikman
The pronunciation just gets better and better.
Jerod Santo
I want to do it well. Am I doing it well?
Lars Wikman
I think you're pretty good on the first name now. It's kind of weird coming out of an American still, but I couldn't tell you what's weird about it anymore. So you're doing well.
Jerod Santo
Okay, I'll take that.
Amal Hussein
It's like a fine wine... He's just aging, but the aging is, like, his pronunciation. It just keeps getting better.
Jerod Santo
I started off doing it your way as a bit of a joke, because it's difficult for me to do it. But then over time, I'm like "Well, I'm getting a little bit better at it, and he likes it... So let's just take away the satire and just call him Lars", you know?
Lars Wikman
Yeah, that's my name.
Jerod Santo
So I appreciate that I'm doing well. Okay.
Lars Wikman
It's a pleasure to be here, as always.
Jerod Santo
For you Americans in the audience, it's Lars Wikman.
Lars Wikman
Lars Wikman.
Jerod Santo
So if you've heard that name before, that's also him. Finally, playing last, because hey, we're gentlemen around these parts, it's Adam Stacoviak...
Amal Hussein
How am I still going first?
Adam Stacoviak
Amal's denied... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Yeah, help...
Jerod Santo
I can't change the game. The game has been decided; you can't change the rules in the middle of the game.
Amal Hussein
Alright then, whatever...
Adam Stacoviak
On video I'm waving my tiny hand...
Jerod Santo
Adam is here... He was bragging before he started that he got much sleep, he's done his stretches, he's got his coffee...
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Jerod Santo
He's ready to dominate.
Adam Stacoviak
Mentally and physically prepared to dominate. And I have my tiny hand to prove it.
Amal Hussein
He's also wearing a Texas hat. Like a good Texan, showing that Texan pride, you know?
Adam Stacoviak
You've gotta rep, you know?
Jerod Santo
He's gonna be calling him Lars Wikman.
Adam Stacoviak
Lars Wikman. That's how I say it. Sorry...
Jerod Santo
There you go...
Lars Wikman
That's fine...
Jerod Santo
And of course, I will be your host. My name is Jerod. Here's how the game works. I will provide a word; that word also has a definition. These words are in the arena of STEM. The original conceit was that they would be old, obscure computer science jargon. Unfortunately, there's just not enough of that, and so I broadened it to anything in the world of science, technology, engineering, medicine, maybe even science fiction. We shall see. But they are generally technical terms. You may know the definition, you probably won't. If you know the definition of the word, you will submit that to me, and you will receive three points. If you don't know the definition of the word, you will submit a fake definition that is plausible, and we will gather them all together and we will read all the definitions, including the real one. Then, you will take turns - and Amal will go first - guessing which definition you think is correct. If you do guess the correct definition, you get two points. For each person you fool into guessing your definition, you get one point. There are 10 rounds of play. The person with the most points at the end wins. And by the way, I'm also playing, because if all four of you fail to guess the correct definition in a particular round, I get five points.
Amal Hussein
This is like -- the house always wins, kind of situation.
Jerod Santo
We'll see who wins. So I have a vested interest. Any questions before we kick right in?
Adam Stacoviak
Can you do the rules again, one more time?
Jerod Santo
No. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Well, just the first rule. What's the first rule? Or the first, how do you win? You either -- you make somebody guess yours, or you fool them into guessing the plausible?
Jerod Santo
Yeah, I'll do the points again.
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, do that, please.
Jerod Santo
So for each round, there's a word. If you submit to me the correct definition of the word, or close enough that I know you know what it means, you get three points right away.
Adam Stacoviak
Okay.
Jerod Santo
So that's three. If instead you guessed the correct definition once we've compiled them all, then you get two points. For each person that guesses your fake definition, you get one point. So in any particular round, you could get the two, and you could also get some ones if people guess yours. Makes sense?
Adam Stacoviak
Makes sense.
Jerod Santo
\[06:07\] Okay. And 10 rounds, the person with the most points at the end wins. I think we'll figure it out a little bit as we go. Let's start this game of \#define. Round one. The word for round one is megger. Please submit to me your definition of the word megger.
Amal Hussein
And that's not to be confused with meager, right? To be clear.
Jerod Santo
Correct. Megger. I also put it in the chat if you want to read it. You'll DM those to me whenever you're ready. Take your time, think it through. Try to sound like a dictionary. Lars is in. Oh, no. You've sent me a bunch of plus signs.
Lars Wikman
I needed to demarcate the conversation line to the game.
Jerod Santo
Oh, I see. You've started a new segment of our conversation, wherein you are going to define things. I understand. Alright, I've got Lars'es... Taylor, I've deleted your message, because you've put it in the group chat...
Taylor Troesh
Oh, my gosh...
Jerod Santo
Did anybody see it?
Adam Stacoviak
No.
Jerod Santo
I copied it and deleted it. So I have it, and nobody else saw it. So from now on, please DM that to me.
Taylor Troesh
I am so sorry. I have limited real estate here on my screen.
Jerod Santo
All good. I thought that might happen, so I was kind of waiting for someone to say something in there...
Taylor Troesh
Sorry about that.
Jerod Santo
All good. As long as no one saw it, we are legit.
Lars Wikman
I'm pretty sure this is actually just the nickname of a girl named Meg...
Amal Hussein
This is where I feel like I need a po-po-poker po-po-poker face... It's like "Hm, am I lying? Am I not?"
Adam Stacoviak
That's not what she says though...
Amal Hussein
Isn't it poker face?
Adam Stacoviak
No. No, that's not what she says.
Jerod Santo
It's poker face, isn't it? That's the name of the song.
Adam Stacoviak
No, sorry. You're all wrong.
Jerod Santo
What does she say?
Amal Hussein
What does she say?
Jerod Santo
School us.
Amal Hussein
Is there like a not-safe-for-work version?
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, it's not safe for work.
Amal Hussein
Oh, my god...
Adam Stacoviak
This cannot be on the pod.
Amal Hussein
This was supposed to be the safe for work version, so...
Adam Stacoviak
Well, that is the safe for work version then. And you're right.
Jerod Santo
Alright, everybody's in?
Amal Hussein
Yeah.
Jerod Santo
Alright, I have all definitions. I will read them all now. Listen closely, you're going to pick which one you believe is correct, and you'll tell it to me in order. So a megger is a math ledger for storing large datasets, typically known to be a precursor of blockchain. Used by mathematicians and academics. A megger is a specialized instrument used to measure electrical insulation resistance. A megger is also known as -- sorry... \[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
Is this the same one, or what is this?
Jerod Santo
Sorry. Yes, this is another definition.
Adam Stacoviak
Okay.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
What's happening here?
Taylor Troesh
It's the next one, for sure. It has to be the next one. It seems legit.
Jerod Santo
It seems legit... \[laughs\] Alright.
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, this is not the correct one.
Amal Hussein
Wow, Jerod is red. I've never seen you turn red, honestly. Okay. Wow... This is the hardest I've seen you laugh all these years, you know?
Jerod Santo
I'm trying to read this with a straight face... With a poker face, and it's impossible. \[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
Wow, this is a -- we need like a robot Jerod.
Jerod Santo
I'm gonna read a different one and come back. A megger is a small, often wooden box, used for storing a tangled nest of wires. Amal, you're not helping here...
Amal Hussein
\[10:05\] Sorry. \[laughter\] I'm just realizing, all these sounds so official, but like clearly, people are making s\*\*t up, you know?
Jerod Santo
Totally. A megger is a hardware device for measuring network traffic in data centers, or also known as -- gosh, this one's funny... Also known as megger flask - a tool used to mix a hydrous solutions together, with the goal of achieving a homogenous solution. Okay... \[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
What's so funny about that?
Taylor Troesh
That's just chemistry.
Jerod Santo
It's good. It's good.
Adam Stacoviak
It's good.
Amal Hussein
It's anhydrous, for what it's worth...
Jerod Santo
I know, but I couldn't tell if that was a typo or not... \[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
No, the typo was with the goal of achieving a homogenous solution. Not is achieving... \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Okay, fair enough.
Amal Hussein
I'll fix that...
Adam Stacoviak
So Amal wrote that one.
Amal Hussein
Clearly.
Jerod Santo
Well, maybe. Alright, we will start... We promise that other rounds will go better, as the host... It's just "also known as megger flask" just got me, for some reason. It was just awesome. Alright, we will go to Amal. So do you need any definitions reread? Do you remember them? Which one do you think is the correct definition?
Amal Hussein
What was the one that you read before mine -- well, what was the one that you read before? \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
I read all of them before yours... \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Oh, boy...
Amal Hussein
Oh, gosh...
Jerod Santo
Okay, a hardware device for measuring network traffic in data centers?
Amal Hussein
No...
Jerod Santo
Is that the one that you're thinking of? I can reread some more... A specialized instrument used to measure electrical insulation resistance. A small, often wooden box, used for storing a tangled mess of wires. Also known as megger flask, a tool used to mix anhydrous solutions together, with the goal of achieving a homogenous solution.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, I'm gonna go with that anhydrous. Let's go with that anhydrous one. That sounds real legit.
Jerod Santo
Alright, Amal goes for anhydrous. We now turn to Taylor. Which definition do you think is correct?
Taylor Troesh
I think it was the first one.
Jerod Santo
The first one was "A math ledger for storing large datasets."
Taylor Troesh
Yeah. It sounds right.
Jerod Santo
Alright. We now turn to Lars. What do you think is the correct definition?
Taylor Troesh
I liked the part where you said insolence, so I'm going with the insulation thing.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Okay. Lars goes for insolence. And Adam. Which one do you think is correct?
Adam Stacoviak
Hm. What was the second one again, Jerod? Number two?
Jerod Santo
A hardware device for measuring network traffic in data centers?
Adam Stacoviak
Yes, I'll go with that one.
Jerod Santo
Alright. All have been submitted. Okay, Adam, we'll start with you. You thought that a megger is a hardware device for measuring network traffic in data centers. I'm sorry, that was Lars'es definition. So we'll give one point to him. Good job, Lars. And Lars, you thought it was a specialized instrument used to measure electrical insulation resistance... And you are correct. So you get two points.
Lars Wikman
I'll take it.
Amal Hussein
I'm glad my instincts are correct, because that's what I would have really picked, if I wasn't trying to...
Jerod Santo
Taylor went with the math ledger. That was Adam's definition. So Adam gets a point for having Taylor guess his. And Amal's definition - she voted for herself, which you cannot actually do, so it's zero points awarded...
Amal Hussein
It's a tactic...
Jerod Santo
It's a tactic to convince people that yours is the correct definition. Unfortunately...
Lars Wikman
Trying to legitimize it, yeah.
Jerod Santo
Yeah. Unfortunately, I had already bombarded you with laughter on yours... I will work harder not to do that next time. I apologize.
Taylor Troesh
Give her the point. You tanked her opportunity.
Amal Hussein
You did. You did. I would agree.
Jerod Santo
Fair enough. Fair enough. That's a good point. I will give you one point. So after round one...
Adam Stacoviak
Can you read the correct definition again? What was the true definition?
Jerod Santo
\[14:00\] Yes. A megger is a specialized instrument used to measure electrical insulation resistance. And that was hard for me to read as well.
Taylor Troesh
Also known as insolence...
Adam Stacoviak
And this is separate from the megger flask. This is not the same definition. It's a whole different one.
Jerod Santo
A megger flask is Amal's creation.
Adam Stacoviak
Nice. That was good.
Jerod Santo
For some reason, just because that definition started with kind of redefining the word, like "Also known as a megger flask", I was like -- it just made me laugh. Alright. We will move now to round two. Your word for round two - rubber sheet model. More than one word, but it's a term. Rubber sheet model. Please submit your definitions for a rubber sheet model now.
I'm literally sweating, guys, I'm laughing so hard. It's also warm in here, so that didn't help, but man... I lost it. I never thought the hardest part of this would be actually reading out the definitions aloud. I'm going to increase the font size. Also, as an FYI, I'm reading these in like random orders. So when you say "Can you read the second one again?", it's very difficult for me to know what you're referring to. Reference a concept in there at least...
Amal Hussein
It sounds like a you problem, Jerod.
Jerod Santo
It is, but it's also one that I don't think I can solve in the next few minutes...
Lars Wikman
Random axis...
Amal Hussein
It's like, somebody forgot to -- you're just using the wrong data structure, you know?
Lars Wikman
Yeah, the order is undefined.
Amal Hussein
Exactly.
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Lars Wikman
If you keep asking for an offset, you're just gonna get one of them.
Jerod Santo
Right.
Lars Wikman
The best part about how funny that answer was, that definition was, is that it was actually a serious, straight across the bow...
Jerod Santo
Yeah, it wasn't that ridiculous, was it? For some reason, just "also known as megger flask", just... It made me think of Megalodon, or something... I don't know. I started thinking about a giant shark-like creature.
Amal Hussein
Well, my other definition was gonna be like a portable centrifuge, but then I was like "That sounds way too science fiction." Also, who wants a portable centrifuge? I mean, maybe if you're like a gourmet barista maybe, where you're like "I want to mix the perfect coffee..."
Jerod Santo
Alright here comes Adam's. We're ready to rock. Let me just put this in. A rubber sheet model is used in factory injection molds during the early prototyping phase of a metal cast. Or - a rubber sheet model is a physical analogy for demonstrating the effect of mass and gravitation in space-time. Or - a framework used to provide a template for bootstrapping a wide variety of rubber sheets with consistency and uniformity as a primary objective. Or - a concept in software design that allows for flexibility and expansion in various directions. Finally, a model used for creating gypsum molds for casting in other materials. This round we start with Taylor. Which of those sounds the most correct to you?
Taylor Troesh
Well, we have two that I think are around molding, so I'm gonna pick one of those. Maybe pick the gypsum one, because I think gypsum is a little bit too random for somebody to think of, you know...
Jerod Santo
Okay, a model used for creating gypsum molds for casting other materials. That's Taylor's vote. We're going out to Lars. What are you thinking?
Lars Wikman
Okay, I'll go with the other molding one then, the factory one.
Jerod Santo
Using factory injection molds during the early prototyping phase of a metal cast?
Lars Wikman
I like "an early prototyping phase." Let's go with that.
Jerod Santo
There we go. Alright. Adam, what are you thinking?
Adam Stacoviak
What was the last one again?
Jerod Santo
I don't know...
Adam Stacoviak
\[17:58\] Maybe copy and paste on our main channel, so I can visualize and read them afterwards and choose one.
Jerod Santo
I don't know if that's good. That requires more massaging by me of the texts.
Adam Stacoviak
It does. What a shame...
Jerod Santo
Just listen.
Adam Stacoviak
Alright. What was the first one again? That sounded the most official.
Jerod Santo
Used in factory injection molds during the early prototyping phase of a metal cast? That's the first one I read.
Adam Stacoviak
Let's go with that one.
Jerod Santo
Alright. Lars and Adam, both going for that one. Amal?
Amal Hussein
What was the template one? Could you read that again?
Jerod Santo
A framework used to provide a template for bootstrapping a wide variety of rubber sheets with consistency and uniformity as a primary objective.
Amal Hussein
Okay, I think that. Let's go with that.
Jerod Santo
Okay.
Adam Stacoviak
The criteria on which we select is uncanny. It's like, how do you even make a selection?
Jerod Santo
Well, how are you guys making your selections?
Adam Stacoviak
Must have rubber hand. That's my key here. This is my strong hand. Take my strong hand.
Jerod Santo
Alright, Amal, you thought that a rubber sheet model was a framework used to provide a template for bootstrapping a wide variety of rubber sheets with consistency and uniformity as the primary objective. I'm sorry, but that was Adam's definition.
Adam Stacoviak
That's a falsehood.
Amal Hussein
I should have known from the reaction that he had. He was like "Ha-ha-ha-ha!" \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Oh, reading faces...
Amal Hussein
Yeah, that was obvious...
Jerod Santo
Valid, valid. Reading the face.
Amal Hussein
Well, yeah. I mean, he was just like "Oh, I wonder what's the criteria that people use to select..." But anyways. But it's fine, because I still won, in some other way, which we'll find out soon. So...
Jerod Santo
Ohh, she's bustin' it. Taylor, you thought a rubber sheet model would be a model used for creating gypsum, because nobody would come up with gypsum. But, actually Lars came up with gypsum, so that was Lars' definition.
Lars Wikman
You're not the only one who likes words...
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
This is a nerd podcast.
Jerod Santo
This is, totally.
Amal Hussein
I mean, you should expect nerdy words. The obscure words have their shining moment today, I think.
Adam Stacoviak
Like injection molding?
Amal Hussein
That's correct. Yes.
Jerod Santo
Meanwhile, both Lars and Adam thought that a rubber sheet model was used in factory injection molds during the early prototyping phase of a metal cast... But as was forecast by Amal, that was her definition, so she gets two points.
Lars Wikman
Nice.
Adam Stacoviak
Dang...
Lars Wikman
I knew it wasn't my casting thing, because I made that one up. \[laughter\] So I picked the other one.
Amal Hussein
That's awesome.
Jerod Santo
Well, Amal can brag all she wants, but I get the last laugh, because nobody guessed the correct definition...
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God...
Jerod Santo
...for rubber sheet model... Which is a concept in software design that allows for flexibility and expansion in various directions.
Amal Hussein
Isn't that funny that none of us picked the software?
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, that sounds fake.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, that sounds hella fake.
Jerod Santo
So five points for me... And it turns out I'm winning, after two rounds.
Taylor Troesh
I said the space-time one because I was thinking of that bed sheet. They always put the planets on that bed sheet in the physics videos...
Adam Stacoviak
Oh, yes.
Taylor Troesh
And so I was thinking that's what they were talking about.
Jerod Santo
I'm not aware.
Taylor Troesh
But this is a software thing...
Lars Wikman
Citation needed on the software thing.
Amal Hussein
Yeah.
Lars Wikman
Someone once came up with it in IBM, and it was never actually used.
Amal Hussein
Right, yeah. It's like in a textbook somewhere, so it's official, but it's not actually used in real life. You know what's so funny - I love that this is actually beyond the world of software, because I think the answers are more interesting.
Jerod Santo
Yeah, it was too pointed with just software. I think this makes it a lot more difficult and interesting. Alright, after two rounds, in first place is Jerod, with five; second place is Lars with four, third place is Amal with three. Adam has two, and Taylor, scoreless, I believe after two rounds, if my math is correct...
Taylor Troesh
Zero...!
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Okay, well --
Taylor Troesh
I'm going for negative.
Jerod Santo
Well, there's plenty of time left. Let's move now to round three. Our word for round three, or our term, is - Zeigarnik effect.
Amal Hussein
\[21:54\] This is when I really wish I was Greek, or took like a Latin class, you know, to break down a word...
Taylor Troesh
I don't think effect is a Latin word...
Amal Hussein
You don't think it is? I mean, somebody who's --
Taylor Troesh
I think it's a name, and an effect.
Amal Hussein
I think the Greeks would argue that everything is Greek. It's all Greek!
Taylor Troesh
Jerod, can I get the country of origin?
Jerod Santo
Yeah, I'm trying to find our direct message... It's disappeared on me; this new Slack has just got some issues... Here it is; into there. That's the term - Zeigarnik effect.
Amal Hussein
Oh, interesting.
Taylor Troesh
Oh, hey... Zeigarnik...
Jerod Santo
...nik...
Taylor Troesh
Sorry, nik, yeah.
Jerod Santo
Still early there.
Taylor Troesh
I have it in front of me and I still couldn't spell it. \[laughter\]
Lars Wikman
Just the name of some Swiss guy - I'm assuming Swiss, or something - doesn't give a lot to go off of.
Jerod Santo
Here's what I could probably do... I could probably randomize the order now, and put the numbers in my spreadsheet, in the order in which I'll read them... And then can ask me to read the first or second one again, and then I'll have them --
Amal Hussein
Oh, looks like you fixed your problem.
Adam Stacoviak
I love that.
Taylor Troesh
You're putting keys in your dictionary.
Amal Hussein
Yeah.
Jerod Santo
I love Adam just continued to do it anyways, even though I asked him not to do that... He's like "Can you do the first one? What was the last one?" I'm like "Dude, I have no spatial --"
Adam Stacoviak
That's the order I heard it, so I'm sorry. It's my reference point.
Jerod Santo
It's fine. No, I understand it makes sense for you as the --
Adam Stacoviak
And I'm going to continue to go that route until you change.
Taylor Troesh
I was convinced it was just a stone cold troll, was my read on it.
Jerod Santo
Yeah, I thought he was trolling, to a certain degree...
Adam Stacoviak
I was totally trolling. That's how you got to do it man.
Jerod Santo
Alright, I have one definition here. I'm still missing three.
Lars Wikman
I felt slow this time.
Jerod Santo
Well, as slow as you were, you were still the first one in.
Lars Wikman
I think Zeigarnik just doesn't give people much to work off of.
Taylor Troesh
It took me an extra long amount of time because I knew exactly what the definition was, and...
Lars Wikman
Oh. Right.
Jerod Santo
You had to type it up.
Taylor Troesh
I had to search really deep in my archives...
Amal Hussein
Oh, wow. That almost sounded convincing. \[laughter\]
Taylor Troesh
I had to recall all the facts about Alfred Zeigarnik...
Amal Hussein
Yeah, yeah.
Adam Stacoviak
Copy-paste to spreadsheet, put in order of numbers... Answer number one is...
Jerod Santo
Alright. The Zeigarnik effect is a repulsion of two basic liquids due to polar functional groups. The tendency to remember uncompleted tasks better than completed ones. The state change between polymatter particles when opposing magnets forces are applied to metallic objects; discovered by classical physicist Edgar Zeigarnik. A measured result of extreme sensory deprivation combined with high altitude sickness. The impacts are feeling colors, and hearing shapes. Or - the phenomenon where an electrical motor can be run in reverse to absorb energy; commonly used in electric vehicles for regenerative breaking. Lars, you get to go first this time. Which of these do you believe is the Zeigarnik effect?
Lars Wikman
I like the one where you see colors and hear shapes, or whatever.
Jerod Santo
Okay. A measured result of extreme sensory deprivation combined with high altitude sickness; the impacts are feeling colors and hearing shapes. We go now to Adam. Which do you think is the real definition?
Adam Stacoviak
Number two.
Jerod Santo
Number two, the tendency to remember uncompleted tasks better than completed ones?
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Jerod Santo
Is that what you're referring to?
Adam Stacoviak
Yes.
Jerod Santo
Alright. And Amal? How about yourself?
Amal Hussein
Could you repeat the physicist one again?
Jerod Santo
Yes. The state change between polymatter particles when opposing magnetic forces are applied to metallic objects. Discovered by classical physicist Edgar Zeigarnik.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, that sounds interesting. Let's go with that.
Jerod Santo
Alright, that's Amal. Last up, Taylor. What are you thinking?
Taylor Troesh
\[26:18\] I think Zeigarlic effect is when they put too much garlic on your pasta, and it ends up being so good. Just so tasty.
Adam Stacoviak
Just so good.
Taylor Troesh
I say "Bring me Zeigarlic."
Jerod Santo
That one can't be true, because there's no such thing as too much.
Amal Hussein
There's no too much garlic. Exactly. Never too much.
Jerod Santo
Can't be real.
Taylor Troesh
But I think the Zeigarnik effect is the memory one.
Adam Stacoviak
Number two.
Jerod Santo
The one that Adam voted for.
Taylor Troesh
Number two, exactly.
Jerod Santo
Alright. So Adam and Taylor. Okay.
Amal Hussein
It's tempting, but I'm gonna stick with the mind. I'm curious...
Lars Wikman
I was tempted by the memory one. The Edgar one, I feel like someone put a name in there to seem serious...
Amal Hussein
You know what? Hold on... Can I change my vote?
Jerod Santo
No.
Amal Hussein
Oh, darn it. I'm sorry, for the editors, let me say darn it, instead of what I said before.
Adam Stacoviak
You can say "Zeigarnit!"
Amal Hussein
Yeah, Zeigarnit?
Jerod Santo
Zeigarnit. Well, somebody put the word Edgar Zeigarnik in there in order to fool Amal, and that person was Adam.
Amal Hussein
Oh, for sure. Yeah. 100%. I realized that. I was like "Yeah." Adam, I keep falling for your BS. Something's going on here.
Adam Stacoviak
Ah, I'm so believable.
Amal Hussein
I know.
Adam Stacoviak
It's the tiny hand.
Jerod Santo
Meanwhile, the impact of feeling colors and hearing shapes was voted by Lars, but that was Amal's baby. You made that one up, Amal. Nice job.
Amal Hussein
I know. I'm on a streak.
Jerod Santo
I thought that was pretty cool. The impacts are feeling colors and hearing shapes.
Amal Hussein
That happened to my friend that was having a baby. She was like giving birth, and then -- it's called synesthesia, or something like that. I don't know. That's the actual real term. Yeah, anyways...
Jerod Santo
Adam and Taylor teamed up to vote for the tendency to remember uncompleted tasks better than completed ones. That is the actual Zeigarnik Effect. Good job, guys.
Lars Wikman
Oh, yes!
Taylor Troesh
Nice! I'm out of the zero point --
Jerod Santo
You are on the board, Taylor. So two points for Taylor, three points for Adam, because he had the correct answer, plus one person guessed his. Amal scores one, and Lars throws up a zilt show in round three.
Taylor Troesh
Welcome to the club.
Jerod Santo
So after three rounds, there's a tie for first place between Jerod and Adam... This is kind of poignant; this is kind of correct. This is our show after all. Lars has four, Amal has four, and Taylor's on the board with two, but any person's game here, because we have six rounds left to play.
We move to round four.
**Break**: \[28:58\]
This is a TLA round, a little bit different. This is a three-letter acronym. I'm simply going to provide an acronym. There's also a correct use of that acronym, with a definition. So you are going to come up with your own acronym, and then define what it is. The acronym is NMR. So that's your three-letter acronym, NMR. You will provide to me what it stands for, and what that is. Submit to me your answers whenever you have them. This is still in the same general category of STEM. Come on, y'all. I'm looking for some acronyms here.
Taylor Troesh
Expand those TLAs...
Adam Stacoviak
So close. So close.
Jerod Santo
Taylor provided three of them, and no definitions.
Taylor Troesh
I'm giving you a fourth... \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
He's brainstorming in my DMs...
Lars Wikman
Jerod, how do you handle the case where a TLA is overloaded? Because we could submit the correct one, and it might not be the one you have.
Jerod Santo
No, the one I have is the correct one. Your premise isn't correct.
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God... Alright.
Jerod Santo
I love this one...
Amal Hussein
Can I google a spelling? I'm gonna say yes.
Jerod Santo
Well, just spell it phonetically, because I'm the one who has to pronounce it. No one's gonna read it.
Amal Hussein
Really? Okay.
Taylor Troesh
Just don't spell it funny, because then he'll ruin in.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, exactly.
Jerod Santo
Don't say "a.k.a Megalodon", or whatever you said.
Taylor Troesh
Megger flask...
Jerod Santo
Megger flask... Alright, I see Adam is typing...
Adam Stacoviak
Last-minute change in chat, but it's correct.
Jerod Santo
Okay.
Taylor Troesh
The metagame is of course figuring out how Jerod selected these, and whether he went for interesting or boring terms.
Jerod Santo
Alright, we've got our last one, I believe... Alright, we're all in. Ready to go?
Amal Hussein
Yeah.
Jerod Santo
Our three letter acronym is NMR. Neuromagnetic resonance, a subprocess of magnetic resonance imaging, MRI; used to specifically calibrate each neurocapture node, which captures full-spectrum images of active brainwaves. Number two, neuromotor response, a wide set of neurophysical responses used as a category in medicine. Number three, nephrological micellar retusa. That's a hard one to pronounce. A disease of the kidneys, where the filtering tubules develop clogs and cause return of unfiltered blood into circulation. Number four, neuromuscular reeducation - a physical therapy technique used to improve neuromuscular control and coordination in patients.
Amal Hussein
How is that NMR?
Jerod Santo
Neuromuscular reeducation.
Amal Hussein
Reeducation? \[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
Really pushing the boundaries there.
Amal Hussein
I'm gonna pass on that one... \[laughs\] But okay.
Jerod Santo
And last, but not least, number five...
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh, here he goes again.
Jerod Santo
No More Roombas - a movement to reclaim our floors from the tyranny of robots.
Amal Hussein
Hey man, that sounds way more legit than anything, anything that was read before this. That sounds so legit.
Jerod Santo
Alright, we start with Adam this round. Adam, which definition do you think --
Adam Stacoviak
The correct definition is number two.
Jerod Santo
You're thinking neuromotor response?
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, I think so too, for what it's worth... But you didn't ask me yet.
Jerod Santo
Alright. Well, I'll ask you next. Amal, what do you think? Number two?
Amal Hussein
Neuromuscular response. Because that's like --
Jerod Santo
Neuromotor.
Amal Hussein
Yes. Motor. Same thing.
Adam Stacoviak
All of the first one sounds pretty interesting, too.
Jerod Santo
Adam and Amal are on the neuromotor response. Taylor, which one are you thinking?
Taylor Troesh
You know what has motors? Roombas.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Taylor Troesh
We need to rid ourselves of them.
Jerod Santo
That's true.
Taylor Troesh
Let's go with that kidney one. I don't think Jerod would have picked an acronym he couldn't pronounce, but I'm drawn to it.
Jerod Santo
\[38:05\] Okay, you're thinking of nephrological micellar retusa?
Taylor Troesh
Yeah.
Jerod Santo
Alright.
Amal Hussein
I mean, it would make sense for an acronym too, right? Like, who wants to say that? Just call it NMR.
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Jerod Santo
That is a hard thing to say. That's true. Okay. Lars?
Lars Wikman
I am tempted by that one as well... Can you read it again?
Jerod Santo
Nephrological micellar retusa - a disease of the kidneys where the filtering tubules develop clogs and cause return of unfiltered blood into circulation.
Lars Wikman
Do I feel like one of us wrote that? I'm skeptical... I'll go with that one.
Jerod Santo
Lars is in... We have some lumping here, which is good for your host, because the more you guys lump, the least you spread the field out across all definitions. There's a metagame for you...
Amal Hussein
Adam, should we spread out? I feel like we should spread out.
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, I think somebody should pick number one.
Amal Hussein
I think you should. I think you should pick number one.
Jerod Santo
Adam, do you want to switch to number one?
Adam Stacoviak
I've already chosen number two. I feel like, Amal, you should go with number one. Because they're both in the same realm. They're both in like the neuro somethings.
Amal Hussein
Let's do the opposite of ladies first here, okay?
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
Adam first.
Jerod Santo
Alright.
Amal Hussein
Number one for the number one Texan in my heart, you know?
Adam Stacoviak
I really believe number one is not the answer, in consideration of number two. So I'm gonna stay with number two.
Jerod Santo
Okay, let's start with Taylor and Lars, this lump of cells filtered around the kidney...
Adam Stacoviak
Oh, gosh...
Jerod Santo
Thinking there's no way I would pick one that I couldn't pronounce, but slugging it anyways... And you would have been right, because I never would have picked that one. I can't even say it. That's Amal's. She wrote that one.
Adam Stacoviak
I knew it was Amal's, because she's been laughing every time you say tubular... She's like laughing. Tubula.
Jerod Santo
I couldn't even say that one. I was trying my best. Did I pronounce it right?
Amal Hussein
Tubules. I don't know if I spelled that correctly. You did say correctly. Adam is just giving you a hard time, because Adam is trash, okay? \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Okay... Oh, okay...
Amal Hussein
Fightin' words, okay? \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Well, let's find out about that trash, because you and him teamed up on neuromotor response, which happens to be Lars'es definition, so you're both also wrong.
Amal Hussein
Aww... You know, Lars, I'm so happy to see that you fooled both of us, really. You deserve this, buddy. Honestly -- especially after falling for my things multiple times now... So it's great.
Lars Wikman
I like it that you put a lot of definition into yours. I make mine really, really dull, and it seems to be working okay...
Amal Hussein
Well, no, I was just -- I remember the first time I learned about nephrology, it was like my friend that was dating this medical resident, and I'm like "Oh, interesting. What are you specializing in?" And he's like "Nephrology." And he pointed to his kidneys, because no one knows what nephrology is... And I was like "Is that liver?" He's like "No, it's your kidneys. I'm a kidney specialist." I'm like "Okay, great." Whatever.
Taylor Troesh
Pointing to just your organs... That's like --
Jerod Santo
That's a power move, you know?
Amal Hussein
Well, ophthalmologists do it too, because no one knows what -- apparently, I guess the average American doesn't know what an ophthalmologist is. So it's whenever you meet an ophthalmologist, they're like "Ophthalmology", you know? Pointing to their eyes.
Jerod Santo
Yeah. I'm glad not all doctors point at the body part that they specialize in... Okay, well, the person smiling ear to ear here should be Jerod, because I score five points. Nobody got the actual correct answer, which was neuromuscular reeducation - a physical therapy technique.
Amal Hussein
What?! That sounded fake.
Jerod Santo
That's very real. And the score is very real... So after four rounds, first place, Jerod with 10. Second place, Lars and Amal, tied with six. Adams slips into third with five, and Taylor's still sitting on three.
Adam Stacoviak
That round really upset me.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, I think we need to all unite. Like, who cares who wins? It just can't be Jerod, okay?
Jerod Santo
\[41:58\] Play the spread game? Are you gonna play the spread game?
Lars Wikman
See, the thing is, you have to go for the definitions that sound fake. Like Roombas.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] No more Roombas... I was laughing at that, because it was kind of silly... But the more I thought about it, it actually could be a legitimate thing.
Amal Hussein
A hundred percent.
Lars Wikman
Not in STEM.
Jerod Santo
Well, you know there's the -- what's that fake conspiracy about the birds aren't real, or something?
Taylor Troesh
Oh, that's a good one.
Lars Wikman
Also not STEM.
Taylor Troesh
That's totally STEM.
Jerod Santo
Yeah... \[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
I mean, I could see the Swiffers and mops of the world uniting... Because mops and Swiffers have been in battle, but like now they've joined forces against the Roombas.
Jerod Santo
Right.
Amal Hussein
So they're like "Yeah, we don't care."
Jerod Santo
You think big broom?
Amal Hussein
Exactly.
Jerod Santo
Big broom put the lobby on?
Amal Hussein
That's exactly right.
Jerod Santo
Okay...
Amal Hussein
I think there's inanimate objects unionizing right now, as we speak.
Jerod Santo
Alright, let's move to round five. We are back to regular old terms. No acronyms on this one. Our word, our term for round five is Riemann hypothesis. Riemann hypothesis.
Amal Hussein
Riemann is a person, I would imagine, right?
Jerod Santo
I will not divulge...
Amal Hussein
Similar to the garlic effect...
Adam Stacoviak
Ziegarnik... \[laughter\] Ze garlic.
Jerod Santo
It's the effect that documents how vampires won't come near you if you wear garlic around your neck. It's the garlic effect. No more Roombas... Someone should start that movement. I'm gonna google that, see if it exists.
Lars Wikman
I've been writing a piece about Roombas with fart spray used in military applications... And the big reveal is you have a US senator that has been acting very strangely recently. It turns out that he's been a Roomba with fart spray the entire time.
Amal Hussein
Wait, what?
Jerod Santo
What do you mean he's been a Roomba with fart spray?
Amal Hussein
Is he like a bioterrorist weapon, or something?
Jerod Santo
Is this like Ferris Bueller, where he acts like he's in his room, but he's not? ...this guy just puts a Roomba with fart spray in his office, so you can't see him, or... What's going on here?
Lars Wikman
He's wearing a trench coat, so nobody knows.
Amal Hussein
What does the fart spray have to do with this? I'm so confused. \[laughter\]
Taylor Troesh
Military applications...
Jerod Santo
"He's wearing a trench coat, so nobody knows..." \[laughs\] That reminds me, I saw a recent clip and there was a -- sorry, I'm distracting you guys; you're trying to think. I'll stop talking.
Lars Wikman
We're just ignoring you the same way we ignore your scores...
Jerod Santo
You're gonna have to \[unintelligible 00:44:41.15\]
Amal Hussein
Lars, that's like some A+ smack talk right there. That's great.
Jerod Santo
First they ignore you...
Amal Hussein
Slowly -- we have to chip away at his confidence. That's how we get him. Jerod is like so stoic, you know? The only way you can get him is through inflicting self-doubt.
Jerod Santo
Well, we'll see if the guys actually can execute on the spread defense or not, but I'm sitting pretty right now. Okay, I think we have them all here.
Taylor Troesh
Well, I actually knew this one, so I'm stoked to get some points.
Amal Hussein
Oh, that's impressive.
Jerod Santo
That is the easy way to score.
Amal Hussein
I mean, you shouldn't have told us that, because now we'll just copy you.
Jerod Santo
Let me double-check this one here... We might have our first drill... He might not be joking.
Adam Stacoviak
Do you know it, Taylor?
Jerod Santo
Alright. So Taylor... Taylor is correct. So Taylor's definition is correct. He gets -- well, I'll say that. Let me gather the rest. Alright, so Taylor's definition is correct. Taylor, you score three points, and you will sit out the rest of this round. Obviously, you can't guess definitions...
Taylor Troesh
Wait, how do I get three points for getting it right, and you get five points for doing nothing? \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Doing nothing?! Excuse me...!
Lars Wikman
This is why we ignore Jerod's score.
Jerod Santo
I resent that notion.
Lars Wikman
\[45:58\] What a scam, dude... \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
This is a scam.
Jerod Santo
I mean, technically, Taylor, I've gotten every single one correct every round, so I'm not sure what you're talking about. Meanwhile, us plebs will guess what the definitions are...
Adam Stacoviak
Oh man, the house should have an alternate definition, and he should still play to get more points.
Jerod Santo
What do you mean? He knows what it is.
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, I mean, if the house has the correct definition, right? So the correct definition's in there...
Jerod Santo
Right... But Taylor knows what it is. Why is he gonna guess? Because he would guess the right one? He already knows what it is.
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, because now everybody can fake it. It'd have been better as a reveal after the round, that he was the winner, because he actually submitted the correct answer.
Jerod Santo
Well, if you do it after the round, you get two points for being right. But if you do it right away, you get three points for being right. So he gets more points this way. Let's play this round.
The Riemann hypothesis is an unsolved problem related to the distribution of prime numbers. Or number two, a claim that all people inherently do good when given equal opportunities and resources. Number three, an educated guess framework used by mathematicians. And number four, the theory that special brown fat inside the body explains why some people stay warmer in cold, and have generally better health outcomes.
Amal Hussein
Did you say brown fat, or round fat?
Jerod Santo
That special brown fat.
Amal Hussein
Wow. I thought that was always like whey-colored, you know?
Jerod Santo
Alright, we start with Amal. Of those - hey, only four definitions to guess from this round; so you have a good chance of drilling it... Which of those four do you believe is the correct definition for the Riemann hypothesis?
Amal Hussein
Could you repeat the first one again?
Jerod Santo
An unsolved problem related to the distribution of prime numbers.
Amal Hussein
And what was the second one?
Adam Stacoviak
Read them all.
Jerod Santo
The claim that people inherently do good when given equal opportunities and resources.
Amal Hussein
Hm... And the third one? You might as well just read them all.
Jerod Santo
Are you listening?
Amal Hussein
I am now.
Jerod Santo
An educated guess framework used by mathematicians.
Amal Hussein
Okay. Let's go with the math one.
Jerod Santo
The educated guess framework used by mathematicians?
Amal Hussein
Yeah.
Jerod Santo
Okay. Taylor already guessed... So Lars, your turn.
Lars Wikman
Alright. I'll grab prime numbers. Adam, it's up to you to take the good people...
Jerod Santo
Okay, he's playing the spread game. He wants Adam to take the good people. Adam, you like good people.
Adam Stacoviak
I'm going with good people. I've gotta spread it out.
Jerod Santo
He's spreading it out.
Adam Stacoviak
We know Taylor doesn't have a correct answer, so the house is somewhere in there...
Taylor Troesh
Exactly.
Jerod Santo
Yeah. But he can't reveal, because he knows too much. Alright. Well, playing the spread game, Amal thought perhaps the Riemann hypothesis was an educated guess framework. That's a good educated guess... But unfortunately, it's wrong. Adam came up with that. One point for Adam. Adam meanwhile went with the good people...
Adam Stacoviak
By force, really.
Jerod Santo
Unfortunately, there are no good people. That's wrong also. And Amal came up with it. So you guys are swapping points.
Adam Stacoviak
Ah, man... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Wow...
Jerod Santo
So either Lars picked his own, or he picked the correct one. What do you think the odds are? Taylor knows that the Riemann hypothesis is an unsolved problem related to the distribution of prime numbers. So two points there. Congratulation, Lars. You got it correct. Taylor, tell us more, because yours was more precise. I had to actually look up to make sure it was the right one. It was. What is this thing all about?
Taylor Troesh
What I'll say about this is this is the first time my mathematics degree has actually helped me in the real world. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Nice!
Jerod Santo
Awesome.
Lars Wikman
I didn't think we brought qualified people onto this...
Jerod Santo
Detail it for us. It's interesting.
Taylor Troesh
If you solve the Riemann hypothesis, you get a million dollars. There's a bounty out there.
Amal Hussein
Really?
Taylor Troesh
It's one of six or seven problems called the Millennium prize. So you've probably heard of P versus NP. That's one of them. Riemann hypothesis is like kind of just as big of a deal, because it would tell us a lot about the prime numbers.
Adam Stacoviak
Which is not 2, 4, 6, 8.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, this would be a really great like Goodwill Hunting Part Two... Let's bring it back. Matt Damon's like 55, He's got a belly, needs some money... You know? We solve this math problem and get him rich. I would watch that movie...
Adam Stacoviak
And now he's the professor. He's the shrink.
Amal Hussein
\[50:20\] Yes, yes, yes, exactly.
Adam Stacoviak
He's gotten out of math because he solved them all.
Amal Hussein
I don't actually know how old Matt Damon is, but for what it's worth, 50 is not even middle age.
Jerod Santo
Are you doing paper mache over there? I mean, what's going on?
Amal Hussein
Oh, sorry. Oh, I'm like opening my mail... I'm sorry, I should stop doing that. \[laughter\] Sorry, I just realized...
Adam Stacoviak
We've heard it the whole time.
Amal Hussein
Oh, you heard everything?
Jerod Santo
You're on a podcast, Amal.
Amal Hussein
Of course... I'm sorry. I'm spacing out.
Taylor Troesh
A paper mache... \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Alright. Well, big round for Taylor, pretty good round for Lars. Hey, good round for all of you all, because I scored zero points, and that's what you're after... Still however in the lead with 10, Lars with eight, Amal seven, Adam six, Taylor still in last, but you have five now, so you are coming back. We move to round six... And your word for round six is zitter bewegung. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh...
Jerod Santo
Yes, I said that correctly. The word for round six is zitter bewegung. It's spelled zitter bewegung. I'm saying it better every time I say it.
Adam Stacoviak
That's the whole thing?
Jerod Santo
That's the word.
Taylor Troesh
It looks like a German word.
Amal Hussein
Can I phone a friend?
Jerod Santo
Do you have German friends?
Amal Hussein
Oh, yeah. So many.
Jerod Santo
No, you can't phone them. This is not "Do You Want to Be a millionaire?" or "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?"
Taylor Troesh
I wish I spoke better German.
Jerod Santo
Yeah, so if you have a background in German...
Taylor Troesh
I barely took French, but German is Nordic enough that there's some familiarity in there.
Jerod Santo
Zitter bewegung. It's hard to say.
Taylor Troesh
There are so many other ways it could be pronounced though...
Jerod Santo
That pronunciation is according to the website that says how to pronounce things.
Taylor Troesh
Pronounciation.com?
Jerod Santo
Yeah, I think so.
Amal Hussein
That's just a bot...
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, I don't know...
Jerod Santo
I don't know what it is either. It's when you google "how to pronounce", and you paste a word into it, and the first one gives you that button, and you push it.
Lars Wikman
Did you guys see the bug in the Google Translate thing a few months ago, where if you posted like chicken in Google Translate, and you asked for it to like pronounce, it would go \[unintelligible 00:52:43.23\]
Amal Hussein
Seriously? That's awesome!
Lars Wikman
It was the funniest thing.
Adam Stacoviak
What \[unintelligible 00:52:51.03\]
Lars Wikman
You could find that online. People have videos of it, but they \[unintelligible 00:52:56.20\]
Amal Hussein
They fixed the bug.
Taylor Troesh
I used a Text to Speech API at one point. It was pretty good... We were trying to do accessibility. It was an education product... But some of the stuff people pasted, especially if it came from Word documents, had like weird characters in there... And suddenly, the whole thing would go \[unintelligible 00:53:23.12\] circumflex." Because like a circumflex is a particular typographic character... \[laughter\] I don't know what characters made it go \[unintelligible 00:53:33.00\] but it had like a weird breath...
Jerod Santo
What was the vibe of the breath? Was it creepy? Was it too loud, that hurt your ears? Was it funny?
Lars Wikman
Kind of creepy, speaking voice level... And then it would say "circumflex", which is just a weird word to throw in there. It's like a full sentence, and then someone put it in a weird period at the end. Like full stop.
Jerod Santo
Okay, I have Taylor's... Y'all aren't making this easy on me. Oh, I should get the order figured out while I wait. Here's Amal's...
Amal Hussein
Wait, I'm editing.
Jerod Santo
\[54:19\] Okay, go ahead.
Taylor Troesh
I just got an email that all the prices are increasing on my domains. What's going on there?
Amal Hussein
Yeah. Domainflation.
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, like...
Lars Wikman
Which host?
Adam Stacoviak
What's costing more there, right?
Taylor Troesh
Yeah. Is it costing more for them to like mine the bits out of the --
Amal Hussein
Everyone's gotta pay bills, you know?
Jerod Santo
Yeah.
Lars Wikman
Which host?
Taylor Troesh
This was through Namecheap, but...
Jerod Santo
That hurts even more, you know?
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, right? It's like, come on.
Jerod Santo
Like, cheap is literally in the name.
Lars Wikman
We're also changing our name to... Name.
Jerod Santo
Name, yeah. Name not as cheap... Alright, I think we have -- okay. Everybody ready. Zitter bewegung - a scientific method developed in Switzerland, primarily used in chemistry. Zitter bewegung - the official state fish of Hawaii. Zitter bewegung - shortened to gung, otherwise known as gunk in layman's terms, is the buildup of undesirable substances. Zitter bewegung, the German word for the bittersweet, which is combined, but conflicting feeling of happiness and sadness. Zitter Bewegung - the rapid, oscillatory motion of particles such as electrons in quantum mechanics. There you have it, five definitions for zitter bewegung. Let's start with Amal.
Amal Hussein
I'm gonna need those definitions again... \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Which ones in particular? Should I just do them all again?
Amal Hussein
All of them, yeah.
Adam Stacoviak
Okay. Number one, a scientific method developed in Switzerland, primarily using chemistry. Number two, the official state fish of Hawaii. Number three, shortened to gung, otherwise known as gunk... \[laughter\] Oh, no... \[laughs\] Otherwise known as gunk... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God... Guys, I'm gonna need a bathroom break after this.
Jerod Santo
Number four, the German word for the bittersweet.
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God.
Jerod Santo
Number five, the rapid oscillatory motion of particles. That's not the full definition, but come on, I've given it to you one and a half times. Which one do you think it is?
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God. I think we're just gonna have to go with spread here... What was the first one again? Sorry, you don't have to say the word, just the definition.
Jerod Santo
A scientific method developed in Switzerland.
Amal Hussein
Oh, God. Now that's some --
Jerod Santo
You don't have to say the number you're selecting, just say the general feel. Is it the gunk? Is it the --
Amal Hussein
I don't like any of these, to be honest...
Jerod Santo
Is it the state fish?
Taylor Troesh
I have a vague sense that we can eliminate the gunk...
Amal Hussein
I mean, honestly, last time I thought reeducation was fake.
Taylor Troesh
But Adam was laughing too hard at the gunk.
Adam Stacoviak
I was laughing at Jerod. He can't get it out.
Jerod Santo
I want to go on record, I made it through all five the first time, without laughing. It was the second time that got me.
Amal Hussein
Which one is not the fish? I don't --
Jerod Santo
Which one is not the fish? There's five definitions. Four of them are not the fish. \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Out of the top two.
Jerod Santo
I don't know what your top two are.
Amal Hussein
Okay, just... Can I go again later? Or do I have to go now?
Jerod Santo
It's your turn.
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God. I'll go with number three. Number three.
Jerod Santo
Number three is the shortened to gung. Otherwise known as gunk.
Amal Hussein
Oh, sure. Let's do there.
Jerod Santo
Okay.
Amal Hussein
You know what? No. I'm throwing away points. Let's do four. What's the fourth one?
Jerod Santo
The German word for the bittersweet.
Amal Hussein
\[58:10\] Let's just go with number two, state fish, whatever.
Adam Stacoviak
Oh, my God...
Jerod Santo
Alright, state fish of Hawaii. Taylor likes that choice. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
How in the world does he get points for that? There's no way...
Taylor Troesh
Redistributing the wealth. I love it.
Jerod Santo
We're not finished yet here. We go now to Taylor. Which one are you going to pick? Are you also going to go for the state fish?
Adam Stacoviak
Not number two...
Lars Wikman
No. Get a spread, get a bread.
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, let's spread out. Let's spread out.
Lars Wikman
Go for gunk.
Taylor Troesh
I think I'm gonna go for the bitter sweet.
Jerod Santo
He's gonna take the bitter sweet. Alright. Now we go to Lars.
Lars Wikman
I really like the bitter sweet one, but I don't see how it's STEM. So I'm going too with the oscillating things.
Jerod Santo
Lars goes oscillating.
Amal Hussein
Oh, there is an oscillation option?
Taylor Troesh
No, there wasn't. No.
Lars Wikman
No for you anymore... You've gone already.
Jerod Santo
She's over there doing paper mache. "Can you read those again? I wasn't listening..." \[laughter\] Adam, what's your guess?
Adam Stacoviak
I'm going with the fish. \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Adam goes with the fish. Okay.
Lars Wikman
Not the gunk, or the Swiss chemistry?
Jerod Santo
The gunk and the Swiss chemistry, both apparently not believable...
Adam Stacoviak
But hilarious...
Jerod Santo
Adam and Amal thought that zitter bewegung is the official state fish of Hawaii, but we all knew that was Taylor's, because he made it clear... \[laughter\] So Taylor gets two points. That was a great one though. It deserved the points. Meanwhile, Taylor himself went for the bittersweet... But that was Amal's definition, so one point for her.
Taylor Troesh
Nice, nice.
Jerod Santo
Lars applies the spread, and logic and reasoning, by picking a stem definition. Oscillatory motion of particles such as electrons in quantum mechanics. Yes, that is exactly what zitter bewegung is. So Lars scores two for himself...
Amal Hussein
Wow, nice.
Jerod Santo
...and keeps me off the board.
Amal Hussein
Can we give extra points to Lars for listening to instructions and using clues? I feel like he used everything that was available to him to land the plane safely.
Jerod Santo
He did.
Amal Hussein
So I think points for Lars. Or not Lars, it's Larsh...
Adam Stacoviak
But he didn't make Jerod laugh, though.
Lars Wikman
I think I could have given you the definitions as well, at least roughly...
Jerod Santo
Well, anytime you redefine the word and the definition, I just think it's funny. Like "No, it's not that..."
Adam Stacoviak
Read it again, Jerod. Let's see if you can get through it.
Jerod Santo
Zitter bewegung - shortened to gung, otherwise known as gunk... \[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
I told you...
Jerod Santo
Otherwise known as gunk... I love it.
Adam Stacoviak
In layman's terms.
Jerod Santo
Yeah. In layman's terms. It's gunk.
Amal Hussein
That's hilarious.
Jerod Santo
Alright. Let's read these scores here. I'm tied for first. I'm no longer alone in first place. Jerod and Lars, tied at 10. So he's made an epic advancement. Amal with eight. Taylor with seven. You're now no longer in last. Adam is last, with six.
Amal Hussein
We threw you some points, Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
Thank you, thank you. I needed it.
Jerod Santo
So it's still a very tight game...
Adam Stacoviak
I should not have given him that bonus point... Gosh. Freakin' fish...
Jerod Santo
We now move to round seven. This is a special round. I call it "Give it a goog." It includes the Google web search engine. So I have fed into Google the phrase "Software developers are..." and I stopped, and I let it autocomplete the rest of the sentence. Of course, it provides multiple completions. The top completion I have fetched and held on to. Your job is to complete the sentence, and trick everybody into thinking that you wrote the thing it actually responded with. So if you were to search Google for "Software developers are...", what would be the number one search suggestion to finish that phrase?
Amal Hussein
I think it's important that we set the context here, because it's specific to Jerod's search history, too.
Jerod Santo
Incorrect.
Amal Hussein
Yes, it is.
Jerod Santo
Private browser...
Amal Hussein
\[01:02:07.13\] What? I mean, private? Really? What's private nowadays? Come on...
Adam Stacoviak
He went through an exit node in Sweden, too.
Jerod Santo
Tor Network, private browser...
Amal Hussein
Oh, Tor? Okay, okay. So like vanilla, vanilla...
Jerod Santo
I was at Strange Loop, in the hotel... So let's remove any sort of subjectivity.
Taylor Troesh
Uh-oh... It might have been my search history then.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Okay, it had Taylor's search history.
Amal Hussein
I feel like there's no such thing as vanilla. There's still some reference points that are used to aggregate, but...
Jerod Santo
Fair enough. But your job is to come up with what you think it would say.
Amal Hussein
Okay.
Jerod Santo
And write it down and send it to me at the end, and we will see what happens. Give it a Goog.
Taylor Troesh
We're not supposed to actually use...
Jerod Santo
No. That's the name of the round.
Amal Hussein
So literally, just software developer. That's all you typed. Right?
Jerod Santo
"Software developers are..."
Amal Hussein
Are. Okay.
Jerod Santo
Do not actually give it a Goog. We just named the round Give it a Goog. Alternate names include "Google says", "Autocomplete me", and...
Lars Wikman
"I'm feeling lucky."
Jerod Santo
"I'm feeling lucky." That's a much better name. Good job, Lars. Alright, I have Taylor's, Lars'es, and... That's it. Just missing Adam's at this point.
Adam Stacoviak
Mm-hm... I'm thinking hard on over here.
Lars Wikman
It's like, you have to write literally one word, because that's what Google \[unintelligible 01:03:27.10\] It has to be the right word, of course...
Taylor Troesh
My favorite one of these is -- for a long while you would type in "French military victories", and it would say "Did you mean French military defeats?"
Jerod Santo
Oh, yes, I do remember that one.
Taylor Troesh
That was classic.
Jerod Santo
That was plastic. Maybe you're ready, Adam... Gosh.
Adam Stacoviak
I'm going with the simple version here.
Jerod Santo
Alright, we have all five. Well, I gave it a Goog, and I said "Software developers are..." and it autocompleted one of these five saying. Software developers are... Weird. Software developers are smart, but still have problems finding a girlfriend. Software developers are overpaid. Software developers are rich, or software developers are the new accountants. We will start with Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
Actually, when I hear all those, I think people are going to say overpaid... Because you know, you're in an organization and you just see the person in the cubicle just going late into the night, and you have no idea what that person does... Why is that person getting paid? Yeah, I could see that. Alright, overpaid.
Jerod Santo
Alright. Overpaid. Lars, to you.
Lars Wikman
Weird. I'll go with weird.
Jerod Santo
Weird. Alright. Adam, to you.
Adam Stacoviak
So many answers that are so correct... What's the first one, Jerod?
Jerod Santo
Weird. Second one was smart, but still have problems finding a girlfriend. Third was overpaid, fourth was rich, and fifth was the new accountants.
Adam Stacoviak
Not the overly descriptive one, that's for sure.
Jerod Santo
Easier thinking or trying to read people's faces. Can't tell.
Amal Hussein
Hm... Probably doing both.
Taylor Troesh
Make sure to spread. Lock Jerod.
Amal Hussein
We're just a socialist organization now. It's like...
Jerod Santo
I would guess the same one that everybody else guessed, if I were you.
Adam Stacoviak
There's only one guess so far, right? Taylor. Well, Amal... Who guessed first?
Jerod Santo
Taylor and Lars. Weird and overpaid have both been selected.
Adam Stacoviak
Overpaid...
Jerod Santo
Adams goes with overpaid, not applying the spread...
Adam Stacoviak
Reluctantly.
Jerod Santo
And we go to our last guest, which I guess would be Amal.
Amal Hussein
\[01:05:53.19\] Yeah, for me it's between weird and overpaid... Let's just do overpaid, and whoever's this is -- hopefully it's right, but if it's not, then somebody's getting a lot of points, which is good, because that somebody hopefully isn't Jerod.
Jerod Santo
So Google wanted to autocomplete "Software developers are..." Three of you thought the correct word was overpaid. Lars, were they correct about that?
Lars Wikman
No, but I get some points, I think.
Jerod Santo
He gets some points. That was his, so three points to you, sir.
Amal Hussein
Nice. \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Meanwhile, you thought they were weird... Taylor, was he right about that?
Taylor Troesh
No, no. Um, yes, he was right...
Jerod Santo
No, he was not. He guessed yours.
Taylor Troesh
I mean, they are weird, but Google doesn't think that.
Lars Wikman
I figured one of you would take rich, at least...
Jerod Santo
Nobody took rich, nobody applied the spread. You guys bundled up on one, which I appreciate, having scored five points...
Taylor Troesh
I'm trying here!
Jerod Santo
The actual thing Google said to me when I started with "Software developers are...", the new accountants.
Amal Hussein
That's crazy.
Lars Wikman
Oh, that's surprising.
Jerod Santo
That was interesting, I thought.
Amal Hussein
That was so leftfield... I mean, I had a feeling; I was like "I wonder if that's it", but I was like "Really? I don't know."
Lars Wikman
The girlfriend thing was no, but new accountants - I could see that happening.
Taylor Troesh
I figured that that was like a reference to an essay or something, or some article, and it was... Yeah, that was my guess.
Adam Stacoviak
A headline.
Jerod Santo
Yeah, some sort of training article that everyone's writing about...
Lars Wikman
It could be a book title.
Jerod Santo
A lot of people linking to it, maybe... I don't know, I didn't actually click on it.
Amal Hussein
You know what came up for me? "Software engineers are not engineers." \[laughs\] Sorry, software developers are not engineers. Sorry. Software developers... Software... Isn't that crazy?
Jerod Santo
What is interesting is that I couldn't get it to repeat that one, actually. I tried to get it to repeat, and it'd be different. So it was like different every time now, for some reason.
Amal Hussein
Oh, no, number two is the new accountants for me.
Jerod Santo
Oh, it is? Okay, cool.
Taylor Troesh
For me, number two is overpaid...
Jerod Santo
Aaah...! \[laughter\] I mean, I agree that that would be something I would expect people to put into a search bar.
Lars Wikman
Yeah. Not engineers. New account engineers.
Taylor Troesh
Not real engineers...
Adam Stacoviak
Yeah, I think that the completion of those is usually like the public sentiment in a way, right? That's what people are like searching for, versus the truth...
Taylor Troesh
Versus the truth...?!
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Taylor Troesh
I mean, uh-oh...
Jerod Santo
What are you trying to say, Taylor? Are we the new accountants? I mean, let's psychoanalyze this. What does that even mean?
Taylor Troesh
Some of us are a little bit weird...
Jerod Santo
Oh, I see... \[laughs\] And we might be a tad overpaid... Is that what you're saying? We might be overpaid.
Taylor Troesh
I'm not... \[laughs\]
Lars Wikman
Overpaid or lazy was a pretty good pitch, just to kind of go into some of recent sentiment around engineering orgs...
Jerod Santo
Lazy would have been a good one. Well, overpaid really did get everybody... So that keeps Lars close to first place. I have 15, he has 13... Within reach...
Lars Wikman
You're not in the game, Jerod.
Jerod Santo
I'm literally winning...
Lars Wikman
You're the host...
Jerod Santo
Amal and Taylor both have eight, Adam still sitting at six. There are three rounds left, so it's not without reach. But if you guys -- if you flop another round, I will win... So I would advise to spread from here on out. Let's move to round eight.
**Break**: \[01:09:08.05\]
Our word for round eight is caisson.
Amal Hussein
Not to be confused with JSON, right?
Jerod Santo
Right. Maybe it's caisson, or caisson...
Amal Hussein
Or kaizen.
Jerod Santo
No, it's caisson. It's not kaizen. Let me put it into the chat. It's spelled c-a-i-s-s-o-n.
Taylor Troesh
Can I get the country of origin?
Jerod Santo
I don't know what it is... It looks like maybe it's French.. Yeah, I would guess French. But I don't know what it is.
Lars Wikman
I'm thinking French, from caisson...?
Taylor Troesh
Don't they sell those in bakeries...?
Lars Wikman
Croissant.
Jerod Santo
Well, they almost sell them...
Amal Hussein
Taylor, you've got a really good dry humor, my friend. Points for you.
Jerod Santo
Amal in early this time... Oh, no.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, you wish...
Jerod Santo
You just chatted me.
Lars Wikman
The French episodes where Gerhard talks about infrastructure... No?
Jerod Santo
Sorry, I was in the chat. I would have given you a really good response, of course. Yeah, it is. We're all distracted. Oh, I get it, it was a Kaizen joke. Do you guys ever do that, you you listen in retrospect? Like, you listen to the sentence after it's over with? I just did that. Pretty good, Lars. Pretty good.
Lars Wikman
Yeah, it's like a buffering problem...
Jerod Santo
It is.
Lars Wikman
That's like "That took forever to flush."
Amal Hussein
This might be my best one today, y'all....
Jerod Santo
We've got three...
Amal Hussein
I mean, it helps that I like sort of know what it means, so...
Jerod Santo
We've got four. Okay, our round eight word is caisson... Which is a watertight structure used for underwater construction. Or the sheath around network wiring. Or a method for extracting gluten from wheat, that has been used since the 1600s. Or a controversial chess opening. Or the small intestinal casing of a rabbit, which is commonly used in French fine dining.
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh, we know whose that is...
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Adam Stacoviak
Let's go back to Amal.
Amal Hussein
\[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
I was reading that super-clean, by the way. I was reading it super-clean. Okay.
Amal Hussein
Thank you, thank you everyone. Be here all week.
Jerod Santo
We start with Lars this time. What do you think, sir?
Lars Wikman
Run the two first by me again...
Jerod Santo
The first two? A watertight structure used for underwater construction, and the sheath around network wiring.
Lars Wikman
And the one after that?
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] That's the first two? A method for extracting gluten from wheat. A controversial chests opening, or the intestinal casing of a rabbit, which is used for French fine dining.
Lars Wikman
Yeah, no rabbits... Let's go with the underwater one.
Jerod Santo
No rabbits... \[laughs\] Okay, underwater construction. Taylor, what are you thinking?
Taylor Troesh
I also thought it was the underwater construction, but I'm going for that spread...
Lars Wikman
Fight the Jerod.
Taylor Troesh
So let's do the wiring sheathing.
Jerod Santo
A sheath around network wiring, okay. Adam?
Adam Stacoviak
\[01:16:11.06\] The chess move.
Jerod Santo
The chess move. And Amal.
Amal Hussein
I was gonna go with the network wiring, but then, um... We have to spread the... What's unpicked?
Jerod Santo
The small intestinal casing of a rabbit? \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Yours...? \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Dang it...!
Jerod Santo
Or a method for extracting gluten from wheat.
Adam Stacoviak
I recommend number two.
Amal Hussein
Yeah. We have to play strategically at this point. We cannot have you win, so...
Jerod Santo
Okay. You're banding together, to pick everything except for Amal's...
Amal Hussein
...for the better of humanity.
Jerod Santo
Well, here's the question - if you hadn't giggled, was anybody buying it until the giggle happened?
Adam Stacoviak
No.
Jerod Santo
No? \[laughs\] No hesitation from Adam. He was not buying it.
Lars Wikman
I'm not sure about STEM...
Jerod Santo
Well, an intestinal casing is... That's scientific, right?
Adam Stacoviak
That's biological.
Jerod Santo
Yeah.
Taylor Troesh
It's the French cuisine.
Jerod Santo
It's the anatomy of an animal. I mean, that definitely fits inside the realm of science, right? But the French fine dining is where it went haywire... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Less is more. Lesson learned.
Jerod Santo
Yeah, may be.
Adam Stacoviak
Don't overly explain your definition.
Amal Hussein
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Jerod Santo
Well, a master application of a spread, considering there was five definitions, and you picked the four that had a chance... So yes, one of you landed on it. The question is who. Let's start with Adam. He went for a controversial chess opening... That was Taylor's. So one point for Taylor there.
Amal Hussein
Whoa... Good job, Taylor.
Jerod Santo
Taylor went for the sheath around network wiring. That was Adam's, so swapping points there. Amal guessed a method for extracting gluten. That's Lars'es, so one point there, which means Lars got the correct definition, a watertight structure used for underwater construction. That means he gets two points for being right, plus the one he got from Amal, so that's three points.
So after eight rounds, Lars moves into the lead with 16 points. I am in second with 15, Taylor with 9, Amal with 8, and Adam with 7. And we move now to round nine. This is a special round called "How do you do, fellow humans?"
\[01:18:20.01\]
*How do you do, fellow kids?*
*What?!*
In this round, I turned to ChatGPT and I asked it to make up a fictional word that relates to STEM in a single-sentence definition of the word. It then returned to me what it returned. Your job is to act as if you are ChatGPT, and how it would answer that prompt. The exact prompt was "Make up a fictional word that relates to STEM, and a single-sentence definition of the word." So you will submit to me what your best fake ChatGPT response would be.
Adam Stacoviak
So make up the word, and then to find the word?
Jerod Santo
Make up exactly what you think it replied with, or something that is feasible for that.
Amal Hussein
How are we supposed to guess this correctly?
Jerod Santo
Your ability to approximate a GPT...
Amal Hussein
Oh, okay.
Lars Wikman
Work the spread... Grind... This is all it's about...
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Listen to this guy who's in first place talking about the spread... He's very concerned now.
Amal Hussein
Oh, I see. I see. Because you're gonna tell us both the definition and the word, right?
Jerod Santo
I have written down Chat GPT's response, and I will also read all of your responses. And you will guess which one is ChatGPT.
Adam Stacoviak
Do you mind repeating the --
Jerod Santo
The prompt?
Adam Stacoviak
Yes.
Jerod Santo
I'll put it in the chat. The exact prompt is "Make up a fictional word that relates to STEM, and a single-sentence definition of the word."
Taylor Troesh
Knowing ChatGPT, the single-sentence response was two paragraphs...
Adam Stacoviak
Right.
Taylor Troesh
So you're gonna get a lot of text here.
Jerod Santo
Taylor's already in. He's the first one in.
Adam Stacoviak
I'm putting this in the group chat, because where else would I put it?
Amal Hussein
Why are you putting it in the group chat?
Adam Stacoviak
I'm just messing with you.
Jerod Santo
He's being facetious.
Amal Hussein
Okay, okay, okay. I was like "Wait a second..."
Adam Stacoviak
\[01:20:04.02\] So that's like three of five times...
Taylor Troesh
The software developers code was a pretty good complete...
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh, here we go... Verbatim, Jerod. Verbatim. You have to read it verbatim.
Jerod Santo
Okay... \[laughs\] Can I survive it verbatim? We have all definitions?
Taylor Troesh
We think so...
Jerod Santo
Okay, I prompted ChatGPT "Make up a fictional word that relates to STEM, and a single-sentence definition of the word", and it responded with one of these five responses. Number one, sheheldism - when salt dissolves in water, and forms a wave pattern in the water. Number two, clorpus, the underbelly of a cha-cha engine. Number three, hyperincision - a very small and precise medical procedure performed with nanoscale-edged robot scalpels. Number four - xylofluxotron, a groundbreaking device capable of converting sound vibrations from musical instruments into a clean and sustainable energy source. Number five, "I can help with that. Hydraloader is the word. The definition of the word is a pipe-like object used to move liquid substances. Hope that helps." We start with Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
Well, it's definitely "I can help with that."
Jerod Santo
Going with "I can help with that?"
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, yeah.
Jerod Santo
Okay. Lars.
Lars Wikman
So it's the completely unedited response from ChatGPT that we're trying to go for...?
Jerod Santo
Yes.
Lars Wikman
Then it's "I can help with that."
Jerod Santo
Okay.
Taylor Troesh
No, I'm pretty sure "I can help with that" is Adam's... Because he said verbatim.
Lars Wikman
You think so?
Taylor Troesh
So then I was like "Oh, it's Adam's." And I like Adam, so I wanted to throw him a point. \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Good logic.
Amal Hussein
Sneaky, sneaky... Oh, I love that.
Taylor Troesh
But now, Lars, you're making me feel bad, because I'm misleading people...
Jerod Santo
Yeah, misleading people... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
You misled me, Taylor... Okay?
Jerod Santo
Or did he? The verdict is out yet.
Amal Hussein
No, you didn't actually mislead me. I actually thought that was legit. I was like "Good job, Adam", because I was like "Yeah, ChatGPT always starts with something helpful and ends with some things like helpful.
Lars Wikman
He could also be playing mind games right now, because he wants these points for himself.
Adam Stacoviak
It's true.
Amal Hussein
Taylor, or Adam, or Jerod?
Taylor Troesh
Yeah, all of them. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
All of them. They're all against me.
Jerod Santo
I love it. I love it. Which one do you want? The first one.
Lars Wikman
The first.
Jerod Santo
That was the sheheldism? When salt dissolves in water and forms a wave pattern in the water?
Lars Wikman
The second one was...
Jerod Santo
That's clorpus.
Lars Wikman
Which was...?
Jerod Santo
Oh, sorry. I thought we all knew. The underbelly of a cha-cha engine. \[laughter\]
Lars Wikman
I Just wanted to verify which one Taylor's was...
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] I was fine until I looked at -- I read it fine until I looked at Taylor's face, and I couldn't hold it any longer.
Taylor Troesh
I caught the laugh the first time, but I couldn't remember which one was which, so yeah... I'll go with the salt wave thing.
Adam Stacoviak
Taylor already had his answer submitted. It was submitted. The answer was submitted.
Jerod Santo
Adam is not happy with this game.
Adam Stacoviak
And then Taylor was like "Hey, listen, listen, this is my logic here."
Lars Wikman
Adam, mind the spread...
Adam Stacoviak
Gosh...!
Jerod Santo
Mind the spread... Lars is winning, you know... Do you want him to win? I mean...
Amal Hussein
Yeah. He's from Sweden, he's already winning. I mean, let's be real.
Jerod Santo
That's true. Alright, Amal, what are you going with?
Amal Hussein
I'm gonna play the spread game. I was gonna go the ones that were already selected, but... What was number four?
Jerod Santo
Four was the xylofluxatron. Two was clorpus, three was hyperincision.
Amal Hussein
Okay, xylofluxatron. Let's go with that.
Jerod Santo
\[01:24:04.01\] Okay. And that leads with Adam. What are you going with, sir?
Adam Stacoviak
Well, the incision one was Amal, because I saw her giggle with the incisions... What was the first one again, Jerod?
Jerod Santo
The first one was when salt dissolves in water. The second one was clorpus, the cha-cha engine.
Adam Stacoviak
Right.
Jerod Santo
Three was hyperincision.
Adam Stacoviak
Let's go with the cha-cha engine.
Jerod Santo
Cha-cha engine. Alright. Well, let's start right there, then. Adam thought perhaps ChatGPT's fake word plus definition would be clorpus, the underbelly of a cha-cha engine. That indeed was Taylor's. It was very difficult to read that one without laughing, because he was just on cloud nine over there.
Taylor Troesh
My initial submission was "I am sorry, but as an AI language model I cannot create big definitions."
Jerod Santo
I actually thought that was legit... I thought it'd be a decent answer. But we all know that they can make stuff up all the time. \[laughs\] But I did like the response.
Amal Hussein
It's what they do, yeah.
Adam Stacoviak
So Adam picks Taylor's. Meanwhile, Taylor picks the "I can help with that. Hydraloader is the word, etc. Hope that helps." And yes, that was Adam's and he is giving Adam a point. He almost tricked all of us into selecting that...
You have to admit I had y'all tricked.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, no, you really -- I was gonna pick that.
Adam Stacoviak
Had Taylor not given his logic away, it was the selection down the board.
Taylor Troesh
Sorry, sorry... Yeah, it was either that, or one of the others. Like, it immediately divided the field.
Adam Stacoviak
It stood out because it was so believable. Nobody else's was like full response. I thought like "How would the ChatGPT truly respond?"
Jerod Santo
The question is, Adam, had you not told me to read it verbatim, would we have actually fell on for it? Because I was going to read them verbatim regardless, so...
Adam Stacoviak
Yes...
Lars Wikman
And Taylor, if you had submitted the "I'm sorry, as a language model", yadda-yadda, that would have been two answers that felt more like ChatGPT than any of the real ones.
Jerod Santo
Right.
Taylor Troesh
But I thought of the cha-cha engine and I had to do it. \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
The cha-cha engine was really selling it. It was good.
Jerod Santo
It's the underbelly of a cha-cha engine. Now, Lars picked the sheheldism, which is when water salt dissolves in water and forms a wave pattern in the water. That was Amal's...
Amal Hussein
Yeah, Adam, that was mine...
Adam Stacoviak
What?!
Amal Hussein
I'm allowed to giggle.
Jerod Santo
She giggles all the time.
Amal Hussein
Giggle does not equal --
Adam Stacoviak
It's your tell. It's your tell.
Jerod Santo
Or she could giggle at a different time, and really screw with you.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, exactly.
Taylor Troesh
I think she giggled because it was a feasible one...
Amal Hussein
Yeah, that's why. That's why I giggled. Good job. That's exactly why. I was like "That sounds real. The hyperflexism sounds real." Or whatever it is. Yes.
Jerod Santo
Now, nobody picked hyperincision... That was Lars'es. So he didn't score any points there. Amal picks xylofluxatron, which was ChatGPT's response, was xylofluxatron.
Amal Hussein
\[laughs\] See, I didn't even realize \[unintelligible 01:27:07.01\]
Jerod Santo
So Amal gets two points for that, three points on the round. But for everybody's sake, she saves me from scoring five, which would have given me the victory. After nine rounds, we have in first place with 16, Jerod with 15, Amal with 11, Taylor at 10, Adam at 8. We move now into our final round. And the word for this round is petechiae. There you go, I put it in the chat for you to read it yourselves. The word is petechiae. Sorry, I said it wrong. Petechiae. That's it. I've been saying it wrong. It's petechiae. My apologies. Okay, submit your definitions as soon as you have them.
Amal Hussein
\[01:28:01.26\] Is this also STEM?
Jerod Santo
It's all STEM. It's all STEM.
Lars Wikman
It's a lot more poker face kind of dealings in this game than I would have expected...
Jerod Santo
Yeah, you wonder if it'd be a completely different game without video.
Lars Wikman
Probably not nearly as fun.
Jerod Santo
It's really hard not to smile, laugh or giggle when your definition is being read, I imagine. It's hard for me to read them.
Lars Wikman
I think it's hard for Taylor not to write funny ones.
Jerod Santo
I know, all of his are just on the edge of being like "Gosh, can I read this with a straight face or not?"
Lars Wikman
Very few of them are on the edge of being believable...
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\]
Taylor Troesh
Uh-oh... Should I change this one? I put "petechiae - Adam's middle name..." \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Adam's middle name... \[laughs\] That's classic. Adam Petechiae Stacoviak. Well, this is for all the marvels - can Lars actually convince everybody to use the spread, or will they gang up on him and actually try to score points naturally?
Amal Hussein
I know. I mean, I think we should discuss that right now. I mean, how do we want to play this, y'all? I mean, Jerod is still on the leaderboard, right? He's like number one...
Jerod Santo
I'm in second...
Amal Hussein
Oh, you're in second. Okay.
Taylor Troesh
Doesn't he always win like Family Feud, and all of those?
Jerod Santo
Frontend Feud? Oh, no, the debate shows. I always declare myself the winner of the debate shows. Frontend Feud we play it straight.
Amal Hussein
Yeah. So I think we just -- I think at all costs Jerod can't win.
Jerod Santo
You're just against me.
Amal Hussein
It's not that I'm against you, its that I've been on so many rig'ged games with you, where you just always win.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Rigged!
Amal Hussein
Yeah. So it's like...
Adam Stacoviak
"I've been on so many rigged games with you..." Wow.
Amal Hussein
Yeah. Which is -- now I want to rig this game, to rig you back, you know? So that's my...
Jerod Santo
Fair, fair. Alright, for our fun final round, petechiae. We have five definitions. The first one is the reverse form of patina, which derives from its Latin origin word patinae. It's the process of reverse rusting, when objects are placed in a vacuum with 0% humidity. Number two, tiny red or purple spots on the skin caused by broken blood vessels. Number three, the chief animal byproduct used to create toothpaste. \[laughter\] I hadn't read the final word and it surprised me. \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Oh, my God...
Jerod Santo
I should have read the whole thing in my head.
Amal Hussein
No, that reaction -- we need to get that video. That video needs to go on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube... It needs to go everywhere. Your face just like realizing that that was funny... And then you just burst out laughing. That was priceless.
Jerod Santo
I need to preread the entire thing.
Taylor Troesh
Can we get that one again?
Jerod Santo
Yes, the chief animal byproduct used to create toothpaste. Or, number four, the smallest bone in your body, which is located in your head. Number five, an Atlantic algae that is being investigated by scientists for its regenerative properties.
Amal Hussein
Ooh. Oh my God, these are all really good.
Jerod Santo
These are good, you guys.
Amal Hussein
Great job, everyone. We've really --
Adam Stacoviak
Stepped up our game.
Amal Hussein
...we started on the bottom and now we're on the top, y'all. The top of our game.
Jerod Santo
Ten rounds.
Amal Hussein
We're ending this on a high.
Taylor Troesh
I no longer want to use toothpaste.
Jerod Santo
We're gonna start with Adam... Do you need me to reread any of these?
Adam Stacoviak
If you're not first, you're last. I've been going last...
Amal Hussein
Only if you promise to laugh again, Jerod.
Jerod Santo
\[01:31:51.03\] I can't make any promises, but likely...
Adam Stacoviak
Yes. First, you must reread that one, of the toothpaste, which is not my selection. It's not my selection. The last one is my selection.
Jerod Santo
The last one, which is the Atlantic algae.
Adam Stacoviak
Yes. Let's go with that, the Atlantic algae.
Jerod Santo
That's being investigated by scientists for its regenerative properties.
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Jerod Santo
Okay, that's Adams.
Adam Stacoviak
I believe that's the truth.
Jerod Santo
Amal.
Amal Hussein
I'm gonna go with the capillaries, the broken capillaries...
Jerod Santo
The broken blood vessels?
Amal Hussein
Sure.
Adam Stacoviak
Good choice, whoever wrote that one.
Amal Hussein
Oh, really, Adam? Is that a good choice? You know what, I'm gonna take it back.
Jerod Santo
Okay... \[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
My last point is not going to Adam. \[laughs\]
Jerod Santo
Where are you gonna put it?
Amal Hussein
Could you read the second one again, or the first one?
Jerod Santo
The first one was the reverse form of patina, coming from patinae. The process of reverse rusting.
Amal Hussein
That sounds like something Taylor would make up. What was the third one?
Lars Wikman
But he made up the toothpaste.
Amal Hussein
That was him, the toothpaste one? I don't even --
Jerod Santo
How do you know that...?
Lars Wikman
Do you think he was the toothpaste...?
Jerod Santo
How do you know that?
Amal Hussein
Yeah, I don't think there's such a thing as reverse rusting.
Jerod Santo
Well, it also says it's placed in a vacuum of 0% humidity.
Lars Wikman
That's the science.
Amal Hussein
Is it really Taylor Mr. Math?
Lars Wikman
It's the science.
Amal Hussein
For the love of the spread, let's just go with that.
Jerod Santo
You're gonna go with that. Okay. So you're going to the reverse rusting. Alright, we move now to Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
Well, I know it's not the smallest bone in the body, because doctors told me that mine was my funny bone...
Amal Hussein
Is that subjective, or is that like for everyone?
Taylor Troesh
No, it's science. It's total science.
Lars Wikman
STEM.
Taylor Troesh
That means that I'm going with the -- not the capillaries, but the blotchy skin, whatever that is...
Jerod Santo
Tiny red or purple spots on the skin?
Taylor Troesh
Yeah. I know it doesn't sound right, but also, I'm drawn to it, for some reason.
Jerod Santo
\[laughs\] Very mysterious, Taylor.
Taylor Troesh
It doesn't look right, but...
Amal Hussein
I thought that the capillaries was the same as the red blotch, because broken capillaries do cause redness... So...
Jerod Santo
That's the one that Adam was excited that Amal picked it.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, but you know...
Jerod Santo
So you switched it, but Taylor's gonna pick it anyways. He's drawn to it.
Taylor Troesh
I'm drawn to it.
Jerod Santo
He's drawn to it. Okay, Taylor's going to the skin problems. He's just drawn to them. And Lars is the last one.
Lars Wikman
What's left that hasn't been picked?
Jerod Santo
The unguessed one is the chief animal byproducts used to create toothpaste...
Lars Wikman
Yeah, nah.
Jerod Santo
...or the smallest bone in your body, which is located in your head.
Lars Wikman
I don't think that's correct, but I'll take the bone.
Jerod Santo
You don't think it's correct, but you'll take it. \[laughs\]
Amal Hussein
My whole thing was Adam has called me out too many times. I'm not giving any points to Adam.
Lars Wikman
I need to prevent Jerod points.
Jerod Santo
I think that could be a show title. "I don't think it's correct, but I'll take it."
Amal Hussein
Yes, that's right. Literally. "I don't think it's correct, but I'll take it."
Jerod Santo
I always thought the smallest bone in your body was in your ear. That's what I was told.
Adam Stacoviak
It's true. Which is technically in your head.
Jerod Santo
True. True.
Amal Hussein
I mean, bingo.
Jerod Santo
Alright. Well, Lars gets that one. He didn't think it was right; he was right, it was not correct, and it was Amal's. So... \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Thanks. Thanks, Lars.
Jerod Santo
Meanwhile, Amal went for the reverse patina. That's reverse rusting, and that was made up by Adam. Nice one, Adam.
Amal Hussein
What?! Adam?! What the hell...?! \[laughter\]
Adam Stacoviak
Gotcha!
Amal Hussein
You fake-pushed me into something. You know what? We're gonna have to play this again, y'all. We're gonna have to do this again. This is unfair. I'm sorry...
Jerod Santo
In fact, Adam almost won me the game, because the correct answer was "Tiny red or purple spots on the skin, caused by broken blood vessels", and he almost scared everybody off it... But Taylor was drawn to it.
Amal Hussein
That was my first choice...!
Jerod Santo
And so Taylor gets two for getting the correct answer.
Amal Hussein
You know what, I'm gonna just -- the lesson of this game is trust your instincts, okay? As long as Jerod doesn't win...
Adam Stacoviak
That was a good definition, right?
Jerod Santo
That was good. Meanwhile, Lars also scored a point, because his was the Atlantic algae, that's been investigated. And Adam guessed it, so that's one for him.
Adam Stacoviak
I knew that was wrong, but I could not select the correct one, which was mine...
Amal Hussein
Right. Funny...
Jerod Santo
\[01:36:11.03\] \[laughs\] Fair enough. Alright, well, you guys successfully spread, and Taylor saved the game by being drawn to red or purple spots on his skin.
Amal Hussein
So who was the patina one, the reverse patina? Who made that up?
Jerod Santo
That was Adam's.
Amal Hussein
Oh, sorry. Oh, my God... See, in my rage, I'm already forgetting.
Adam Stacoviak
See?!
Jerod Santo
I think you guessed Adam's in almost every round. I think he really had your number.
Adam Stacoviak
Yes. You were drawn to my words. You liked my words...! Admit it.
Amal Hussein
I do. I do. I do.
Adam Stacoviak
I give fake good definitions.
Amal Hussein
It's all these years of listening to Changelog, I blame that.
Adam Stacoviak
That's right.
Jerod Santo
Right. We're just so authoritative with what we say; you're like "It has to be true."
Adam Stacoviak
Last time I checked, bandwidth for Changelog was provided by Fastly.
Jerod Santo
Learn more at Fastly.com. Okay, Lars, congratulations, my friend. After 10 rounds of \#define, you are the champion, with 17 points. Congratulations! \[applause\] And because we don't have much to give away around here, what we're going to give you is an open microphone. So we do have people listening, and I hope - maybe by the end of this they aren't anymore, but... If you had anything you could say to the listening audience as your victory dance, you get to say whatever you want, and you get to say it right now.
Lars Wikman
I guess I'll shill. Go to Underjord.io and check out my series of recent blog posts on unpacking Elixir. I want you all to get really, really deep into Elixir. It's a good language, a good ecosystem, a good community... And I've been writing a ton about it recently. So get in on it.
Taylor Troesh
Is it Underjord or Underjord?
Lars Wikman
Underjord.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, for us Americans over here, could you spell it out?
Lars Wikman
Underjord.io.
Jerod Santo
We could do a bonus round where everybody writes what they think they'll find when they go to Underjord.io. Just kidding, you'll find some awesome blog posts about Elixir, just as Lars said.
Amal Hussein
A picture of a yurt? Just kidding...
Lars Wikman
I think there's a series of four recent unpacking Elixir series blog posts. You can put those in the show notes if you like. Or you can just go to Hacker News on any given day and chances are I'm there.
Jerod Santo
Oh, flex. I like that. Find him on Hacker News, on the front page, usually number one...
Amal Hussein
Like top 10, top 20? What are we talking about?
Lars Wikman
Yeah, sure.
Taylor Troesh
He could hit the frontpage more often if he wrote about good programming languages...
Jerod Santo
Ohhh...!
Taylor Troesh
I'm just kidding. I'm kidding, I'm kidding.
Lars Wikman
Do you know how easy it is to get Elixir on that frontpage?
Taylor Troesh
By the way, Taylor.town is written in Elixir. \[laughter\]
Jerod Santo
Ah, friendly fire. Friendly fire. Fair enough. Well, this has been our first game of \#define. I hope you all enjoyed it as much as we did... Lots of more laughs than even I expected. I apologize in advance for not being able to read definitions without giggles, but... It's just the way it went down, y'all. Any final thoughts, criticisms, feedback from the panel on this particular game? Because it's an experiment; we can change things. We make up the rules as we go. I think Adam's reluctance to not use numbers paid off, because we ended up finding a solution there, making the game better... Anything else we can do to improve \#define for future generations?
Taylor Troesh
Never get better at reading them. It's an important part of making it fun.
Adam Stacoviak
A few more people...
Jerod Santo
Yeah, I think more people will be good. More definitions.
Adam Stacoviak
\[01:39:51.26\] Less rounds and more people.
Jerod Santo
Less rounds, more people.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, less rounds, more people. I love that.
Jerod Santo
We could reduce the points that the moderator gets for a miss, from five down to three, maybe.
Taylor Troesh
Increase.
Jerod Santo
Increase? I mean, then you're just playing the spread every round, but... I think the spread would get annoying if you actually think you know what the answer is, but you're playing for the spread... I would guess. What do you guys think? Late in the game, where you're like "Ah, I've gotta spread here, but I don't really want to..."
Lars Wikman
Is there really a point to having it be a game against the moderator as well? I think it makes people play more carefully, especially since it's so heavily weighted towards finding the correct definition.
Taylor Troesh
I think it created more of a kind of meta playing, which I thought was probably a good move.
Jerod Santo
Yeah. It adds another level to the game, to a certain extent. And there's more interaction because you all try to convince each other what to pick or not to pick based on what strategy we're playing, and then you could just -- you could go against that strategy. I think there's another level there. I don't know. Well, this game was very much inspired by a podcast I listened to, which I will commend to our listeners if you like this style of game. There's a podcast called The Incomparable Game Show. They play lots of games, and one of those games they play is called Low Definition, which I have basically modeled this off of and just moved it into a STEM world. So if you liked this, they've got tons of episodes, and you can go listen to those.
Also, let us know; we will do more of these here on Changelog & Friends if you want to hear more. If instead you just want to hear our web browser hot takes every week, let us know that, and we'll just do that every week as well. So that's all from me. Adam, final thoughts before we let everybody go?
Adam Stacoviak
It was so much fun guessing correctly and incorrectly, of course. It was a lot of fun. This is a fun game. I dig it.
Jerod Santo
Yeah.
Adam Stacoviak
And I'll be back.
Jerod Santo
Awesome. Taylor, Amal, Lars, thanks so much for playing.
Amal Hussein
You'll be deceiving ,more like it, right? Instead of "I'll be back."
Adam Stacoviak
I think I've put out some solid answers out there. Yeah, for sure.
Amal Hussein
Yeah, you did.
Adam Stacoviak
I mean, to you, Amal - I mean, you guessed me more often than anybody, so... You like my brain.
Amal Hussein
I know. I'm gonna have to talk to my therapist about that. \[laughter\] We'll be unpacking that.
Adam Stacoviak
I'll hand you a cut sheet of all my answers, so you can revisit them.
Amal Hussein
Right.
Taylor Troesh
I'm gonna tell my therapist to post Underjord.io articles on HackerNews.com. \[laughter\]
Amal Hussein
Oh, yeah... UnderGeorge... It's a different -- maybe a wrong website, wrong forum perhaps...
Taylor Troesh
Underjord. Underjord.io. Jord.
Jerod Santo
The homepage of Lars Wikman.
Lars Wikman
So what I'm gathering here is I should go with the u7d approach and just shorten it.
Jerod Santo
Is that a Unicode thing, or...? I'm missing it.
Lars Wikman
No, it's like K8s.
Adam Stacoviak
The letters between Under and Jord. That's the UD. There's seven between. It's like a16z.
Jerod Santo
\[unintelligible 01:42:43.27\] A16z, i18n, alright, sorry. I've exhausted my ability to reason. Let's say goodbye. Thanks, everybody, for hanging out. We'll be back next week. Bye, friends.
Taylor Troesh
Bye now.
Amal Hussein
Cheers.
Adam Stacoviak
Goodbye...
